Guy Cartwright

Thanks, Debbie.

Sarah Eakin (Webster)

Thanks Debbie.

Barbara Peate (Sabo)

Thanks to all those in our class and their families that have served our country past or present.  Let's continue to honor our flag that represents their sacrifice!

Barbara Peate (Sabo)

Thanks, Bruce.   I saw a sign in front of a church that said "Don't let me come down there - God."

Patrick Gillespie

Thanks Debbie!
 

Linda Peate (Powrie)

Thanks Pat, thanks Guy.  Thanks, Bruce. Thanks for every opinion anyone expresses!  What the heck is happening when people can't even express an opinion without haviing such rah rah other side?  As I said, did Repubs rumble in the streets?  Did we burn things down?  Did we steal from honest store owners when Obama was elected?  No, absolutely not..  And I, like Bruce, was not happy, nor was my husband when Obamacare caused financial stress on our small business trying to figure out healthcare options fair to our employees and fair to our business.  Some of you used to be Republicans.  Now you've changed sides.  GREAT!  That's America!  Each side gets upset for heaven sakes when their party loses.  But all of this is way too much.  I always found election time exciting, until this one when the other side is carrying on like they are.  In four yrs. it'll all change again. We had to wait 8 yrs!  Bruce, you expressed what most Republicans were thinking. And Ellen, that's what I said to begin with that we have to unify, but other sides will not do what we have had to do to get along go along or you will be very unhappy for the next 4 yrs.  And popular vote doesn't mean a thing.  It doesn't get you elected.  If you hate the electoral college, go to Washington and change it.  My husband has always said since I have known him, "don't give me the problem; give me the solution".

Nancy Westerfield (Depew)

Lynn Jaenke (Erb)

This is going to be the only time I post also.  This is actually a letter I wrote to Barb, after some comments on FB.  I feel like it's important for folks to understand why so many of us are grieving.  This is not abouy Hillary, but about human rights and the environment, among other thing.

Dear Barb,

I have been wanting to write for you for quite awhile, and am doing so now to try to open a dialogue.  There are so many misconceptions racing around that it’s hard to think straight. 

Your message on FB said that people were rioting and whining because Hillary didn’t win.  I can tell you that that is really not the case at all.  Every single person I know in Vermont is heartbroken, and I mean that in the literal sense of the word, that Donald Trump is going to be our next president. It has nothing to do with Hillary.

Make no mistake, this was not a normal election…not the way it has been in any election ever.  When every single president who is still alive declares that Trump is a dangerous man, when democrats and republicans unite on this, you can bet something is going on.

Here are the reasons that I am truly heartbroken.

One, I have two beautiful granddaughters.  How do I explain to them that their new president is a sexual predator? This is not hearsay.  We have videos of him saying horrible things.  He has a rape trial coming up.  The woman was 13 at the time it happened.  Donald admitted in interviews that he doesn’t respect women.  Many other woman (some who have witnesses) have come forward talking about his molestations. Many Republicans voted for him because he said he was against abortion, but there are interview tapes of him just a few years ago saying that he was pro choice. He will say anything.  Fact checkers found that he lied 91% of the time when he spoke while campaigning.

I love this earth.  It is sacred to me.  It is our only home, and it is being ravaged by our disregard.  Many people around the world have been fighting hard to have countries come together to halt climate change.  ALL CREDIBLE  scientists in the world believe in man made climate change.  It has already begun and it makes me sick that a huge coral reef is dead, and the arctic is melting.  This isn’t just about it getting hotter in Ohio.  It means drought, flooding, and massive starvation.  This will lead to many more wars and unrest than we have now.  I am sickened that Trump has already chosen a climate denier to head up the EPA.  I have solar panels and we have a solar array for 39 families in our pasture.  I only say so you know I am serious about this.  I am feeling ill just writing about this.

Since Trump was elected, there has been a huge upsweep in racist hate crimes.  A popular young Saudi student was just assaulted and died in Minnesota.  And you wonder where the terrorists come from?  Watching his campaign rallies, where he mocked a person disabilities, when he encouraged violence in his audiences against any dissenters….I just couldn’t believe what I was seeing.  Shock doesn’t even begin to cover my dismay.  Did you know that he was endorsed by the White Supremacists and Ku Klux Klan?  Even if he didn’t accept those endorsements, that he was given those endorsements says a lot.

Can you imagine being a person of color in this country right now?  An immigrant?  A Muslim?  These are human beings.  And then there are the refugees.  These people have been horribly treated, in ways we can even imagine in their home countries, by the very terrorists we are fighting.  And now we want to tell them we won’t help them.  Jesus would be pretty disappointed.

Which brings me to a question I have.  I am really curious about the number of people who say they are Christian, and then vote for a man who has never, not once, done any service to other humans, who has been married three times, cheating on each of those wives.  Did you know that Ivanka sued him for rape when they were married, but the charges were dropped, just like women everywhere are bullied into dropping charges.?  Anyway, if I could make up any human being who less represented true Christian values, Donald Trump would be the man.

And then there is his mental stability.  We all know he has thin skin, and takes to vile, mean tweeting in the dead of the night when someone crosses him (before he decides to sue them…hundreds of law suits!).  The thought of a man with no inhibitions over his temper being able to start nuclear war is so frightening.  He is not a well man.  Many psychiatrists have said this, but just watching him and what he does says it all.

So, his business sense will get us out of troubles.  He inherited a lot of money, and has gone bankrupt five times.  Every single person who has worked with him closely says he is a terrible person, and should not be trusted.  Many people who he contracted to do work for him were unpaid.  Many of them lost their livelihoods because of that.  He just is not a nice person.  I have never heard anyone say he was a fine man. 

Now I read tonight that he and the Republican congress are going to get rid of Social Security, which is doing fine by the way.  I will lose my home of 40 years if that happens.  People like my daughter, who are disability, need support from their government.  We are the ONLY developed country in the world that doesn’t have universal health coverage.  I was in Norway for the third time this summer.  Yes, they have high taxes, but their childcare is paid for, all their health from cradle to grave is paid for, the college education is paid for.  They value education highly and there aren’t the discrepancies that we have in our country in education.  People all live pretty nicely.  They drive great cars, vacation in Greece, have ski holidays in the mountains.  They, of course, think we are nuts.  I was truly embarrassed when I was there this summer.  It is a fact that people all over the world think Trump is a terrible joke. 

So, this is why I am heartbroken.  To think that all the progress in taking care of our beautiful earth will be turned back, that civil rights will be rolled back, that we will build this stupid wall at the border (not by Canada though, because they aren’t brown skinned people).  I read today that Trump’s tax reform will highly benefit the very rich, and huge corporations, who already make out like crazy.  Why would he care for us little guys?  He never has before.

I don’t know if I will send this to you, but I couldn’t sleep last night over it.  I know I have been pretty complete here, but my passions and rage are running high.  But, truly, I would really, really like to understand why people voted for Trump.  It is a mystery to me, but there must be a valid reason, and I promise to really try to listen to what you write. I am sure that not all people who voted for Trump are bigots.  I really do want the nation to heal, but I am having a hard time understanding how it can in the climate of hate that Trump has brought up.  The one thing that has happened is that all the racism and bigotry has now been legitimized, and we have to face it.  I am pledging to be kind and compassionate to all the people I meet and know.  I want to give back to the world with my harp and my work in hospice.  I want to teach my grand children to be strong women, who are respected.  I want to see the Earth healed.  It is almost too late already for that, and reversing what we have done will be awful.  I don’t want that kind of world for my grand children.  Do you?  What are you saying to them when they hear Trump’s sexual bragging? What will you say to them when our world is destroyed by our greed?  We could easily leave the oil and coal in the ground and have renewable energy get us by.  Germany is doing that right now.  But the huge energy corporations are making sure that doesn’t happen, and it is a tragedy of unbelievable proportions. 

Please, please tell me why Donald Trump got all the votes.  Nobody here understands.  Of course, Hillary actually won the popular vote.  I hate the electoral college.  It screwed Bernie also, who could have been the savior for our country.  I promise to read really respectively.  I haven’t heard much hate up here….just genuine dismay, shock, horror and sadness.  Being a liberal, a much maligned word, means caring about others, and wanting the best for everyone in the country, not just a few.  This is what Jesus would teach, I know it. 

And one final thing.  Obama did some things I really didn’t like, like the drone strikes in the middle east, but EVERY SINGLE marker is better since he took office.  Everything is doing better financially. Much better.  And his family is the most upstanding family to be in office in decades.  So, I am curious about this hatred for him.  If you can tell me why he is hated, then maybe I will stop believing that is just because he is a black man.  Help me with this.

Oh, Michelle Obama got castigated for wearing a dress that showed too much of her shoulders.  Now we are gong to have a first lady who has posed more than once in the nude, in provocative sexual poses.  Another great role model for my grand daughters.  I am flabbergasted.

So, please, help me understand.  And then I can try to explain it to all the people up here who are so hurt and disappointed at the trajectory our country is taking.  At any rate, we will reap what we have sown, and it will be interesting to see what happens.  I do know that most of the people who voted for him thinking he will help the middle class will probably be sorely disappointed.  But, we shall see.

I hope you really read this and understand that we are disappointed, not mean.  We are scared to death for our children, and the earth they will inherit.  I want to understand more.  And I figure you might be able to help me with that.  I appreciated how you have always been loving to me on FB, and been a real supporter.  I hope we can continue that way.  And thanks for reading and trying to understand why we are all so shocked. 

Love, Evergreen

Susan Gammel (Jacobsen)

Beautifully said, Evergreen. And amen.

Linda Peate (Powrie)

This is too much.  It's OK to be concerned, but scared to death?  Blessings to all.  Nothing more

Nancy Westerfield (Depew)

Deborah Murray (Sloan)

And I, too , say Amen to my beautiful and loving life-long friend, Evergreen.  Your words are so compelling that I hope and pray that others will read them and listen to them in their hearts.

Jeanette Livermore (Danford)

Wow!  Best forum responses ever, thank you all for sharing your thoughts.

Lynn Jaenke (Erb)

I want to make it clear that I was not tageting Barb when I posted the letter I wrote to her.  I had posted it to her the night before, and when I read Bruce's post, I felt that it was appropriate to post what I wrote to her to the whole group, if just for representation from another viewpoint.  I apologize to Barb if she felt that I was targeting her.  I wrote it in some hopes of exposing my deepest heart, and I chose her just because she had written some things on FB (nothing bad or inflamatory) that made me want to clarify my viewpoint.  She asked me to consider deleting the message, but I feel an obligation to keep it up there, even though I may be skewered for it.  My hands were shaking and my chest was tight when I sent it, but now that it's out there, I think it will stay there for now.   

Alan, I think this kind of conversation on our website can be valuable if we can learn to listen to each other.  It is hard right now, because feelings are very high, but I encourage answers to the questions I put forth in my letter. I will read them respectively if they are written respectfully.  

Barbara Peate (Sabo)

So everyone understands I never dreamed Everylynnie would post something that she wrote to me personally after something I posted on my timeline, which indicated I was tired of people trying to "right fight" about how Trump shouldn't have been elected.  We all voted, and we had an outcome as we did when Obama was elected for not 4 but 8 years.  We all had to accept that. There was no looting and burning of property, it was accepted.  I don't care for whom anyone voted.  It is our choice and our right.  But, I didn't have a chance to think about how I would answer Everlynnie, with whom we have had great respect for each other and our opinions, before she posted it here for what I consider kudos or support. Some of you have done that, which is fine.  I have no problem with it.  That is what elections are all about.  Just so you all know, I considered the note she wrote to me to be personal and never expected something private to be posted publicly.  Totally disappointed, but we will always be friends.  I will never unfriend someone for their opinion as others have done to me.  As all can see, everyone has had an opinion.  Now, let's forget and go forward and hope we all can come together as a nation under God and the U.S. flag!  Thank you Bruce, Linda, and Nancy for your views also!  God Bless the USA!

Ellen Aspinwall (Templar)

Debbie:  Thank you again!!!

Evergreen:  You have earned the Gold Badge for Courage in heartfelt                                  expression

I spent a great deal of time pre-election asking friends their opinions.  I listened.  I really wanted to know what their ideas and thoughts were.  I'm glad I did.  It was helpful.  

RE:  Social Security.  My son, Le, graduated Phi Beta Kapa in Political Science and spent many years as a political journalist.  In his current position, it is very important for him to stay on top of all things political. Lately, that's been challenging----there has been soooo much.  But, he has done it.  I consider him an authority in his field.  He tells me that President-Elect Trump has stated that he will not touch Social Security.

Nancy Westerfield (Depew)

Ric Winters

Linda Peate (Powrie)

EverL:  The trajectory of this country has been controlled by Obama for 8 yrs.  Don't people get that?  So don't blame Trump for that!  This sounds like high school all over again!  

Nancy Westerfield (Depew)

Sarah Eakin (Webster)

Thank you Evergreen.  You said it so well.

Brian McKeown

For sixty plus years, most of you have been friends and close aquaintences to a greater or lesser degree and, I'm sure, back and forth on the degree at times.  I didn't show until late in the action and left early...but I'm left with one thought.  The one thing that binds us all together is we are all Americans.  We were born that way, and that's the way we will die...sooner or later.  Look around....How many people do you see who have known you your entire life?  How many know the "secrets" of your history in Rocky River?  I'd guess, not a lot.  Keep that in mind as you make these decisions regarding a small war that has just taken place in our society.  It happens each and every 4 years...and has over our entire lifetimes.  Let's not let THIS small war be different than all the others that we have endured over the last 67 years. (I use "67" since it's been that many years since I joined the group and, 1959 was the year that some of us began thinking about politics for real).  Now, we have a great opportunity to sit together (in some form or other) around the fire in the tepee, like the sage, old, battle worn and wise people that we should be and let all speak and REALLY be heard, instead of the bleating, crying or celebrating of political party pundits, fans and prognosticaters. We can...and should...be passionate in our expression of beliefs that our life experiences have fostered...but, we should NOT be deaf to anothers concept that may not have been clearly spoken...or we didn't understand through the half truths that the media puts out.

This new President Elect is different than almost anyone who has been elected before.  He lived a very different life and had very different experiences than any of the politicians we are used to. He succeeded in things that would swallow up most people. He didn't do that with out being extremely intelligent and without making serious mistakes...but what's interesting is he dug himself back out by the means he had available to him at the time, whatever they were.  That's not the point. He's the PE.  We will have him for the next 4 years unless he dies. At that point, we will have Mike Pence.  Personally, I would ask that we all give Trump & Pence a chance and look at what they are doing, or intend to do, with an open mind 

Whatever you believe, DON'T BLOW LIFELONG FRIENDSHIPS OVER THIS STUPID CRAP.  They did that in the Civil War and families still hate each other 160 years later.  NOW.children...kiss and make up.

Brian McKeown

Thanks for the compliment on my writing skills.  Too bad that never happened in school by the teachers.  Then, my grade point wouldn't have been in  the basement or below. 

RE:  the Political stuff, Bruce....We cannot do the gloat or mock thing...even though that's what we received. 

Many of us hated Obama....and still do...and we put up with his "community organizer" actions for the 8 years he was in the White House.   But we also could see that if Hillary got in...the US was totally and completely doomed to be gone in 20-30 years. Most of the conclusion for me was based on the muslim influence.  I have read the Koran and understand who wrote it and how his views changed from what was a beautiful and peaceful religion in the beginning to when , at the end, he was going insane and paranoia and syphillis were overtaking his life.  The religion changed to one of total brutality and inhumane treatment of ANYONE who did not agree with EXACTLY his dictates.  Women & girls were a sub-class equal to livestock. To be bought and sold as chattels.  I fully realize that is the STRICT interpretation of sharia law...but, as you can see with the taliban, isis, and some other offshoots, there are enough of them to change much of the world...not for the better.  France, England, Belgium, the Netherlands, Switzerland,  Australia, New Zealand and others have now put a ban on further refugees from the middle east entering their countries.  Many mosques are being torn down.  Sweeden is now the rape capitol of the world....and guess who's doing most of the raping.

Just on pure numbers... If only 10% of muslims are radical enough to follow sharia law, and the last estimate I saw was 1.7 BILLION muslims...do the math...that's 1.7 MILLION people who want to kill infidels like me...and most of you... who won't change and and will not ever bow to an insane doctrine. 

Someone said something about mistreatment of women, girls, children...if a muslim man decides he would like to" know you better" and you resist, he is entitled, under sharia law, to beat you until he feels you respect him sufficiently.  That goes for your daughters, granddaughters, sisters, YOUNG BOYS, too.  BTW:  In the groups of Syrian refugees, I don't remember seeing many women & children.  Most were fighting age men.  Do you REALLY want them here??  Hillary was going to bring in 500,000 to 650,000 refugees.  Like hell.

Nancy Westerfield (Depew)

Linda Peate (Powrie)

That's interesting isn't it Nancy!   By the way, Bruce, how is your wife?  That's what's important not the loss of an election as some profess.